Updated 26 Jul 2001

WIRKSWORTH Parish Records 1600-1900

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Interesting Mailings

Here are some interesting e-mails from Mailing Lists I subscribe to.

15--[DBY] Pls help decipher & Illegitimacy


The lines quite simply indicate illegitimacy.  The word are 
unnecessary.  I've a reference here somewhere (lost on one of the 
bookcases) which I think details some of the administrative issues 
associated with these records.  I seem to recall that actually 
identifying a child as illegitimate was forbidden, but of course, 
everyone knew what those lines meant!

One thing you can be certain of, this finding in your family is 
remarkably common and I have a wide spread of illegitimate births 
across all of the dozen of family lines I have searched.  Indeed, in 
one case, the parents never married over decades of co-habitation 
and a dozen children.  Actually, I don't think standards varied much 
in my research pre or post 1837 when official registration started.

In the early decades of the 20th Century, it was possible to 
purchase an extract of the birth certificate, rather than the full 
certified entry.  The attraction of this was that it named neither the 
mother or father, and thus hid a multitude of sins. My mother hid 
her own illegitimacy this way for a long time. 

I believe that since around 1969, the father's name can be officially 
placed on the birth certificate in various circumstances - such as 
when the father agreed and was present at the time of birth 

It is possible for the father of an illegitimate child to end up with his 
name on the certificate, even back in the 19th Century, though this 
would have been rare.  Don Steel (1980), "Discovering your family 
History", describes an 1850 birth certificate  where the father's 
name and occupation are given, along with the Mother's name 
(maiden name only).  It is the type of luck we wish came our way 
in these circumstances. Where married, the mother's name is 
usually shown as, say, Helen Smith, formerly Brown.

In the case by Steel noted above, it seems the mother wanted to 
either shame the father, or establish some possible legal hold on him.

Your challenge is to find the father.  The 1861 Census record could 
help, for the parents might actually be living together, and the father 
could even be listed as parent of this child.  Sometimes, the 
parents eventually married and this could leave documention that 
clearly establishes the parentage.  Any wills left by the father, if 
you have any likely candidates, could also acknowledge parentage. 
The eventual marriage certificate of your grandmother may prove 
lucky, with the father named.  If your grandmother (and great 
grandmother) ended up in the Workhouse, you might find another 
paper trail to investigate.


Pat McQuin
Adelaide, South Australia

Today I received a copy of  my grandmother's 1858 birth certificate from 
Evesham.   Instead of her father being identified on the certificate there is 
a line drawn through the space where his name should be, plus a line drawn 
through the space where his occupation should be.  Should I assume there was 
no legal father........or at that time would "illegitimate" have been written 
on the birth certificate if that were the case?  Many thanks for your reply.

Kansas, USA

16--[DBY] Plagues I know there is often a request for this info...she here is what I have. I've extracted it from the Excel programme I created. Year Ailment Place Extra info 1350 Bubonic plague WW* 1499 Bubonic plague UK London 1507 "Fever" UK*1507-51 1551 Influenza UK 1555 Famine UK Rains brought famine & weakness 1556 Bubonic plague UK*1556-63 Extreme 1578 Bubonic plague UK 1586 Bubonic plague UK*Chesterfield. Harvest failed 1591 Acute distress UK 1593 Bubonic plague UK 1596 Famine UK*Harvests failed & epidemics 1603 Bubonic plague UK 1612 Bubonic plague UK 1617 Smallpox US*Native Indians 1623 Bad years UK 2 years 1625 Bubonic plague UK 1626 Bubonic plague UK 1630 Very bad year UK Many died 1631 Bubonic plague UK 1633 Smallpox US*Native Indians 1636 Bubonic plague UK 1637 Bubonic plague UK 1647 Yellow Fever West Indies 1648 Smallpox US 1648 Whooping cough US 1654 Bubonic plague UK 1657 Measles US Boston 1662 Smallpox US NY 1665 Bubonic plague UK Extreme 1666 Bubonic plague UK Eyam 1668 Yellow Fever US NY 1677 Smallpox US*Boston 1687 Measles US Boston 1690 Yellow Fever US NY 1699 Yellow Fever US SC 1702 Yellow Fever US*NY 1702 Scarlet Fever US Boston 1706 Yellow Fever US SC 1713 Measles US Boston 1721 Smallpox US Boston 1723 Influenza WW 1723 Famine UK*7 years poor harvests & epidemics 1728 Yellow Fever US SC 1729 Measles US Boston 1732 Yellow Fever US SC 1732 Influenza WW* 1735 Diphtheria/ scarlet fever US*4 yrs -New England 1738 Smallpox US S.Carolina 1739 Measles US*Boston 1743 Yellow Fever US*NY 1747 Measles US CT, NY, PA, SC 1759 Measles US North America 1761 Influenza US & West Indies 1763 Smallpox US*Boston 1772 Measles US 1775 Influenza WW* 1783 Bilious disorder US Fatal 1788 Measles US PA, NY 1789 Influenza US 1792 Yellow Fever US*7 yrs 1793 Unknown US PA 1793 Influenza US Vermont, Virginia 1802 Smallpox US Nebraska 1803 Yellow Fever US NY 1820 "Fever" US* 1826 Cholera WW*1826-37 1826 Dengue Fever US* and West Indies 1829 Malaria US* 1831 Cholera UK Started WW 1826 1831 Cholera US* 1832 Influenza US 1833 Cholera US Ohio 1834 Cholera US NY 1837 Typhus US PA 1837 Smallpox US Indians 1841 Yellow Fever US 1847 Measles US Indians 1847 Yellow Fever US NO 1847 Influenza WW* 1848 Cholera WW* 1850 Yellow Fever US 1850 Influenza US* 1850 Dengue Fever US* 1851 Cholera US IL 1852 Yellow Fever US NO 1853 Cholera Birmingham?This came from a UK report with the ? 1855 Yellow Fever US 1857 Influenza WW* 1860 Smallpox US*Pennsylvania 1861 Epidemics US*Civil war numerous infectious diseases 1865 Smallpox US* 1865 Cholera US 1865 Typhus US* 1868 Smallpox US*7 yrs 1873 Influenza UK*N.America & Europe 1873 Cholera US 1878 Yellow Fever US NO 1885 Typhoid US PA 1886 Yellow Fever US FL 1889 Influenza WW* 1893 Polio US 1st known outbreak 1900 Plague US* 1901 Smallpox US* 1907 Polio US*9 yrs. 1917 Influenza WW*Worst ever 1931 Polio US 1942 Polio US 11 yrs * - means the epidemic is spread over more than one year. Created by Liz with information obtained from a variety of sources. Kindly notify me of any additional information you obtain so that this can benefit other people. liz@emirates.net.ae
17--[HTMLHELP-L] Guidelines For Publishing Web Pages On The Internet Hello all - The following guidelines were recently reviewed and approved by the Standards Committee and the Board for the National Genealogical Society located in Arlington, Virginia, U.S., http://www.ngsgenealogy.org/. I wholeheartedly endorse these guidelines and hope that all genealogy webmasters, newbie and veteran, will review them and take them into consideration when publishing their web sites. Please feel free to forward this e-mail to all interested parties. Successful surfing, Cyndi ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Genealogical Standards http://www.ngsgenealogy.org/about/content/committees/gene5_stan.html Guidelines For Publishing Web Pages On The Internet Recommended by the National Genealogical Society, May 2000 Appreciating that publishing information through Internet web sites and web pages shares many similarities with print publishing, considerate family historians— — apply a single title to an entire web site, as they would to a book, placing it both in the < TITLE > HTML tag that appears at the top of the web browser window for each web page to be viewed, and also in the body of the web document, on the opening home, title or index page. — explain the purposes and objectives of their web sites, placing the explanation near the top of the title page or including a link from that page to a special page about the reason for the site. — display a footer at the bottom of each web page which contains the web site title, page title, author's name, author's contact information, date of last revision and a copyright statement. — provide complete contact information, including at a minimum a name and e-mail address, and preferably some means for long-term contact, like a postal address. — assist visitors by providing on each page navigational links that lead visitors to other important pages on the web site, or return them to the home page. — adhere to the NGS “Standards for Sharing Information with Others” regarding copyright, attribution, privacy, and the sharing of sensitive information. — include unambiguous source citations for the research data provided on the site, and if not complete descriptions, offering full citations upon request. — label photographic and scanned images within the graphic itself, with fuller explanation if required in text adjacent to the graphic. — identify transcribed, extracted or abstracted data as such, and provide appropriate source citations. — include identifying dates and locations when providing information about specific surnames or individuals. — respect the rights of others who do not wish information about themselves to be published, referenced or linked on a web site. — provide web site access to all potential visitors by avoiding enhanced technical capabilities that may not be available to all users, remembering that not all computers are created equal. — avoid using features that distract from the productive use of the web site, like ones that reduce legibility, strain the eyes, dazzle the vision, or otherwise detract from the visitor's ability to easily read, study, comprehend or print the online publication. — maintain their online publications at frequent intervals, changing the content to keep the information current, the links valid, and the web site in good working order. — preserve and archive for future researchers their online publications and communications that have lasting value, using both electronic and paper duplication. ©2000 by National Genealogical Society. Permission is granted to copy or publish this material provided it is reproduced in its entirety, including this notice.
18--[DBY] History Book Dear Les, copy of Sonia's original posting, Sara in Massachusetts I was recently asked whether I could recommend any newly written Histories of Derbyshire. I wrongly said that nothing worthwhile had been written since the classic 19th century texts - Lysons, Glover, Cox, Tilley, etc. Since then I have seen a review of a substantial new four-volume history, plus mention of three smaller histories on the Internet. I do not know anything about the following three books, but in case anyone is looking for a moderately priced modern history of the county, here are the three smaller books I saw mentioned on the Internet:- 1. "History of Derbyshire," by Joy CHILDS, cloth covered, published by Phillimore, 1 Nov 1987. UKP 12.99. 2. "History of Derbyshire", by John BURGESS, paperback, published by J.Burgess Publications, 1 Jan 1993. UKP 15. 3. "Illustrated History of Derbyshire", by John HEATH, paperback, published by Breedon Books, Derby, 20 May 1993. UKP 9.95. ____________________________ If you are interested in the more substantial four-volume work, it is:- "A History of Derbyshire", by Gladwyn TURBUTT, Merton Priory Press, Cardiff, 4 vols, just published this year - price UK 120 pounds. [Publisher's details below.] This book was given a very good review in the June 2000 issue of "Family Tree Magazine" (p.59), by John TITFORD, a well-respected Genealogist and bookman of Derbyshire. He describes the author as "a member of an eminent family long connected with the county, a former High Sheriff of Derbyshire and President of the Derbyshire Record Society." The review goes on: "An initial survey of earlier attempts to produce a history of Derbyshire, and a description of the county as a whole, are followed by a scholarly and detailed history, written with great fluency and self assurance." - Vol 1 covers to the eve of the Norman Conquest in 1066. - Vol 2 goes from 1066 to 1558, the beginning of Elizabeth's reign. - Vol 3 goes to the eve of Victoria's reign. - Vol 4 "concludes the general historical account, also tracing industrial and agricultural development, communications and transport from 1700, for good measure." "Each volume carries substantial end-notes on the text, arranged chapter by chapter, including name lists that will gladden the heart of family historians." "Gladwyn Turbutt is as much at home with geology, lead mines and forests, as he is with economic and religious history or heraldry, and his knowledge of the county's landed families is complemented by his understanding of the importance of the Arkwrights, the Strutts, and other prominent personalities of the industrial age. Florence Nightingale, Erasmus Darwin, Joseph wright of Derby - all have their place here, as does the ill-fated Pentrich Rebellion and its brutal aftermath." "Illustrations are grouped together at the end of each volume." "This four-volume 'History of Derbyshire' (over 1,800 pages of text and 250 illustrations) is a monumental achievement for a single author to have produced, and whether you are looking for a book to read, or a reference work to dip into, I can commend it to you unreservedly." I take back what I said about there being no good recent histories of Derbyshire. It sounds as if this one is better than anything that has gone before. I retreat before John Titford's recommendation. If you are interested in this book, here are the details for contacting the publishers directly (I have not yet seen this book advertised on websites). Needless to say, I have no connection with this firm or the author. Publisher's address: Merton Priory Press 67 Merthyr Road Whitchurch Cardiff CF14 1DD UK Email: merton@dircon.co.uk Tel: 01222-521 956; Fax: 01222-623 599 Best wishes Sonia Addis-Smith,
19--[DBY] Derbyshire Register Offices On Wed, 6 Sep 2000 15:24:27 +0800, Ronnie Bates wrote: >I need to get in touch with the Registrar at Derbyshire so >can you give me the contacts please email (preferred) or >mail. As a result of this enquiry, I have found that the information about Derbyshire Register Offices on the GENUKI Web pages is currently out of date. We have checked with Derby Register Office for the current names, addresses, telephone numbers and fax numbers for all eight Derbyshire Registration Districts. Before you contact a Register Office, however, it is necessary to find which Registration District would be relevant, and which of the current Register Offices holds the information for that particular District. To do this, there is a useful page on the GENUKI site, URL:- http://www.fhsc.org.uk/genuki/reg/dby.htm The current corrected information on the Derbyshire Register Offices is as follows:- DERBYSHIRE REGISTER OFFICES, September 2000 - The following eight Register Offices for Derbyshire all have different opening hours. - None of them has email facility. - Telephone is the simplest method of contact. - Fax may be used for enquiries and searches only. - For obtaining Certificates, cheques must be sent with orders, by post. Clarify details with the office concerned. - Each Register Office holds only the certificate and index information for its own area. It would be best to check with the office whether or not they cover the place/s in which you are interested. 1. AMBER VALLEY (formerly Belper): Amber Valley Register Office, Market Place, Ripley, Derbyshire, England, DE5 3BT. Tel: +44 (0)1773 841 380 Fax: +44 (0)1773 841 382 2. ASHBOURNE: Ashbourne Register Office, Town Hall, Market Place, Ashbourne, Derbyshire, England, DE6 1ES. Tel: +44 (0)1335 300575 Fax: +44 (0)1335 345252 Registration and Census District (1852 - 1946) 7b 3. BAKEWELL: Bakewell Register Office, Town Hall, Bath Street, Bakewell, Derbyshire, England, DE45 1BU. Tel: +44 (0)162 981 2261 No Fax number Registration and Census District (1852 - 1946) 7b 4. CHESTERFIELD: Chesterfield Register Office, New Beetwell Street, Chesterfield, Derbyshire, England, S40 1QJ. Tel: +44 (0)1246 234754 Fax: +44 (0)1246 274 493 Registration and Census District (1852 - 1946) 7b Please make cheques payable to 'Derbyshire County Council' 5. DERBY: Derby Register Office, 9 Traffic Street, Derby, England, DE1 2NL. Tel: +44 (0)1332 716020 Fax: +44 (0)1332 716 021 Please make cheques payable to 'Derby City Council' Registration and Census District (1852 - 1946) 7b 6. EAST STAFFORDSHIRE (formerly Burton on Trent): East Staffordshire Register Office, Rangemore House, 22 Rangemoor Street, Burton on Trent, Staffordshire, England, DE14 2ED. Tel: +44 (0)1283 538701 Fax: +44 (0)1283 547 338 Registration and Census District (1852 - 1946) 6b 7. EREWASH (formerly Ilkeston): Erewash Register Office, 87 Lord Haddon Road, Ilkeston, Derbyshire, England, DE7 8AX. Tel: +44 (0)115 932 1014 Fax: +44 (0)115 932 6450 8. HIGH PEAK (formerly Chapel en le Frith): High Peak Register Office, Council Offices, Hayfield Road, Chapel-en-Le-Frith, Via Stockport, Cheshire, England, SK12 6QJ. Tel: +44 (0)1663 750473 No Fax number Registration and Census District (1852 - 1946) 7b Best wishes Sonia Addis-Smith Thurleigh, Bedfordshire, England
20--[DBY] Thesis Hello Pat and all, The Institute of Historical Research is online http://ihr.sas.ac.uk/ and is at the University of London SAS http://www.sas.ac.uk/ I found them at http://www.hotbot.com and searched for the EXACT PHRASE Institute of Historical Research They have a good website and claim to list 90% of all UK Ph.D. History Theses (but not Master of History Theses) Click - Search HISTORY On-Line http://ihr.sas.ac.uk/search/welcome.html - click - theses http://search.history.ac.uk/cgi-bin/search.pl?form=theses search Researcher - Bloom The careers of Sir Richard II de Willoughby and Sir Richard III de Willoughby, chief justice of the King's Bench (1338-40), and the rise of the Willoughbys of Nottinghamshire M.R. Bloom. Description: D.Phil. (Oxford) Awarded 1985 Supervised by: J.R.L. Maddicott Usually you have to GO to the college library where the Ph.D. was issued. E.G. - Bloom's Ph.D. Thesis is at Oxford Library. http://www.lib.ox.ac.uk/ http://www.lib.ox.ac.uk/guides/subjord.html I assume Bodleian. Many theses maybe available at UMI (which I find very annoying to use, since I'm not at a University, and do not wish to pay for the service) http://www.umi.com/hp/Support/DServices/ UMI is expensive and charges for searches. But less expensive than trans Atlantic airfare! Many University Libraries subscribe to this service. So if you are not near Oxford (or whatever university Ph.D. depository) check your local University library and ask about UMI (University Microfilm Inc. now apparently owned by Bell and Howell) Also ask your ILL (InterLibrary Loan at major US public libraries) - - - - - - - Back at IHR search Keywords - Derbyshire and get a list of Theses on Derbyshire which include : The surnames of the High Peak hundred, Derbyshire. Graham Ullathorne (anyone have his email address? ) Description: Ph.D. (Sheffield) Research in progress Supervised by: Professor David G. Hey A few have been published such as - Technical, economic and social change in the Derbyshire lead industry, 1540- 1600 D.T. Kiernan. Description: Ph.D. (Sheffield) Awarded 1986 Supervised by: D.W. Crossley A gentry society of the 15th century: Derbyshire, c.1430-1509. Susan M. Wright. Description: Ph. D. (Birmingham) Awarded 1978 Supervised by: E.W. Ives. (If anyone sees these original theses please check to see if they have any will transcriptions not included in the published book) Both are published by the Derbyshire Record Society (which oddly is not mentioned at IHR) http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DBY/drs.html http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DBY/drsPubs.html which by the way published Eyam Parish Register, 1630-1700. Many theses have been published if not in book form in article form. Again it is tedious to find where. IHR is also home of the VCH (Victoria County History) project http://ihr.sas.ac.uk/vch/vchnew.asc.html (Which maybe is why DRS is not mentioned, since the same people "independent" of DRS published the new History of Derbyshire). http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DBY/index.html#History1999 http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DBY/Bibliography/HistoryReview.html which for some reason is not part of VCH. (Is there a tiff between VCH and DRS?) Best Regards, David Blackwell Groveland, Massachusetts, USA I wish people would say where they are. http://genweb.net/~blackwell/my notes http://genweb.net/~books/uk/buk.shtml UK(DBY) Books Online Effort PS - I can't resist. Everyone know what prosopographical means? see http://www.m-w.com/dictionary.htm Every genealogist should know this obscure word. I might add that while university libraries tolerate genealogist, they are NOT helpful to genealogist. So be very specific in your library request and act as if you are a HISTORIAN researching a particular subject. Genealogists should learn to be historians. They will like you better as a historian than a genealogist. After you get your particular Ph.D. thesis, get a prepay copier card, and copy what you need for your personal use. If you hope to copy the whole thing, don't tell anyone (they will stop you if they know) and do not copy it all at once. I copied a large Master thesis appendix at Sheffield University and was eyed suspiciously and told not to copy the whole thing. A version had been published as an article in Recusant History magazine, but not the parts (the wills) interesting to me. DCB
21--[DBY] Old Derbyshire Newspapers On Sat, 7 Oct 2000 09:27:51 +0100, Edward Knighton wrote: >I have specific dates of several obituaries of my ancestors in the >Derbyshire Times from 1880-1900. Can anyone tell me how I might locate >copies of the articles themselves, esp since I am not in Derbyshire that >often. Can one request them for the paper itself, or are they on microfilm >somewhere? The Derbyshire Times is held locally at Derby Local Studies Library and the County Library at Matlock, and probably also by the national Newspaper Library at Colindale, north London - details below. 1. COLINDALE NEWSPAPER Library For Edward, and anyone else interested in using old newspapers as a resource for Family History, you should know about the Newspaper Library at Colindale in London. Here is information given by that useful paperback, "The Family Historian's Enquire Within", by Pauline SAUL, published by FFHS (Federation of Family History Societies), 5th edition, 1995, p.162:- "We are fortunate in this country to have at our disposal a remarkable collection of newspapers of the world at the British Library Newspaper Library, Colindale Avenue, London, NW9 5HE (very near to Colindale Underground Station). "If you know the precise date and location of an event that might have been reported in a local or national newspaper, the Colindale Library will try to locate it for you and you can order a photocopy. You can, of course, visit it yourself and do your own searches. ** Note: If you write, do not expect an early reply, as they are inundated with such requests. "The BLNL has reading rooms with 102 places, 70 for users of original newspapers and 32 for users of microfilm. They are open to readers 10am -4.45pm, Mon-Sat, except for Bank Holidays and a week at the end of October. Persons under 21 are not normally admitted. For further details telephone 020-7323 7353, or send for the leaflet entitled 'Newspaper Library: An Introduction to the Collection and Services'. "You may be able to find what you need a little nearer to home by consulting 'Local Newspapers 1750-1920, England and Wales, Channel Islands, and Isle of Man, A Select Location List', by Jeremy Gibson, FFHS, 1987. It tells you just what papers are available in local libraries, County Record Offices, and other repositories." [See No.3 below for info about the Derbyshire section from this Gibson Guide] 2. DERBY LOCAL STUDIES LIBRARY Derby Local Studies Library at 25b Irongate, Derby, DE1 3GL (tel: 01332-2553930) has a comprehensive collection of local daily and weekly newspapers, some in original format, but many, including the 18th century newspapers, also on microfilm. This is an ongoing project, so I am not sure of how much is currently on microfilm. In an older leaflet (1988) about this collection it says that (and someone else may be able to update this) the most extensive files of newspapers are:- - DERBY MERCURY, weekly, 1732-1933 - mainly microfilm. - DERBY & CHESTERFIELD REPORTER (formerly Derby Reporter), weekly, 1823-1930 - microfilm only. - DERBYSHIRE ADVERTISER, weekly, 1878-1976 - microfilm, plus some bound volumes 1933-76. - DERBY DAILY EXPRESS, daily, 1885-1932 - microfilm only. - DERBY EVENING TELEGRAPH (formerly Derby Daily Telegraph), daily - 1879 to date. Mainly microfilmed. - Collections of the free newspapers, eg DERBY TRADER and DERBY EXPRESS. [Also Derbyshire TIMES, see No.3 below] Also a wide range of periodicals and journals of interest to local and family historians, such as:- - Derbyshire Life and Countryside - Derbyshire County Magazine Another booklet from the Derby Local Studies Library also says this about local newspapers:- In Derbyshire there has long been a policy of placing local newspapers in their home towns, so each library has a selection of county and local titles, historical and current. For full details of what there is and where to see it consult:- - GORDON, R.A. : "Local Newspapers in Derbyshire Libraries", Derbyshire County Council, 1996, price 50p ( or available for reference in the larger libraries). 3. LOCAL NEWSPAPERS 1750-1920, Gibson The 65 page booklet, "Local Newspapers 1750-1920, England and Wales, A Select Location List", compiled by J.S.W. Gibson, for the FFHS, 1987, has the Derbyshire section on pp.12-13, too long to transcribe fully here. Reference: "Bibliography of British Newspapers : Derbyshire, edited by Anne MELLORS, British Library Reference Division Publications, 1987. Early Derby County Newspapers:- - (Drewry's) Derby MERCURY, pre-1750-1920, with Index 1840-60, at Derby Library. - Harrison's Derby JOURNAL, 1776-80, at Derby Library. - Derby (& Chesterfield) REPORTER, 1823-1920+ (gap 1841-2), at Derby Library. - Chesterfield Gazette (Derbyshire COURIER) 1828-1920, at Derby and Chesterfield Libraries (incomplete runs). - Derbyshire CHRONICLE (Chesterfield), 1836-42, at Derby Library. - Derbyshire ADVERTISER (Ashbourne, Uttoxeter, North Staffs), 1846-1920, at Derby Library - 1877-1920+. - Derbyshire TIMES (Chesterfield), 1854-1920+, at Derby Library and County Library at Matlock. There are also newspaper listings under the following local places. Anyone wanting more detail on any of these, just contact me:- - Alfreton (Ripley, Codnor Park, Ironville) - Ashbourne (Dove Valley) - Bakewell - Belper - Buxton - Chapel-en-le-Frith (Whaley Bridge, New Mills, Hayfield) - Chesterfield (Scarsdale) - Clay Cross - Codnor Park - see Alfreton - Derby - Dove Valley - see Ashbourne - Eckington (Staveley, Woodhouse) - Glossop - Hayfield - see Chapel-en-le-Frith - Heanor (Langley Hill) - Ilkeston - Ironville - see Alfreton - Langley Hill - see Heanor - Long Eaton (Ilkeston, Erewash) - Matlock (Tideswell) - New Mills - see Chapel-en-le-Frith - Ripley - Scarsdale - see Chesterfield - Staveley - see Eckington - Tideswell - see Matlock - Whaley Bridge - see Chapel-en-le-Frith - Wirksworth - Woodhouse - see Eckington Best wishes Sonia Addis-Smith Thurleigh, Bedfordshire, England
22--[DBY] Midland Railway Staff Records The Midland's records are at the PRO The PRO leaflet on railway staff records give basic info: http://www.pro.gov.uk/leaflets/ri2189.htm Their on-line catalogue which can be searched at: http://catalogue.pro.gov.uk/ListInt/Default.asp and give details of all class numbers covering MR staff records. The list below is just that - each item in the on-line catalogues has a "details" button which bring more info (though obviously not the records themselves!) These items are from pages 34 to 36 of the 45 pages in RAIL 491 (which covers all aspects of the MR). Note that the catalogue pages are longer than one screen-full, which may not be immediately obvious due to the page being made up of three horizontal frames. Reference, Scope & Date STAFF RECORDS Registers RAIL 491/980 London district, medium and small stations RAIL 491/981 Victoria docks and Poplar RAIL 491/982 Whitecross Street RAIL 491/983 City depot RAIL 491/984 Goods Manager's office, Bow RAIL 491/985 Goods Manager's office, Liverpool Victoria RAIL 491/986 Wages staff fine book, District Commercial Manager's Office, Derby 1897 - 1916 RAIL 491/987 Clerical staff fine book, District Commercial Manager's Office, Derby 1896 - 1921 RAIL 491/988 Telegraph dept., personal staff 1873 - 1884 RAIL 491/989 Telegraph dept., personal staff 1884 - 1896 RAIL 491/990 Telegraph dept., personal staff 1887 - 1911 RAIL 491/991 Telegraph dept., station staff 1877 - 1898 RAIL 491/992 Telegraph dept., station staff 1899 - 1911 RAIL 491/993 Telegraph dept., traffic branch 1906 - 1911 RAIL 491/994 Superintendent's dept. 1899 - 1907 RAIL 491/995 District Superintendent's personal staff 1901 - 1908 RAIL 491/996 District Superintendent's personal staff 1901 - 1909 RAIL 491/997 Birmingham New Street joint station 1897 - 1911 RAIL 491/998 Bristol joint station 1878 - 1911 RAIL 491/999 Burton 1876 - 1908 RAIL 491/1000 Cudworth, Sheepridge, Eckington, etc. 1880 - 1908 RAIL 491/1001 Derby 1876 - 1907 RAIL 491/1002 Gloucester, Bath and Bristol 1876 - 1908 RAIL 491/1003 Kettering, Northampton, Luton, etc. 1880 - 1908 RAIL 491/1004 Leeds 1876 - 1908 RAIL 491/1005 Leicester 1876 - 1908 RAIL 491/1006 Masborough, Staveley and Chesterfield 1876 - 1908 RAIL 491/1007 Nottingham and Beeston 1876 - 1908 RAIL 491/1008 St. Pancras 1876 - 1899 RAIL 491/1009 St. Pancras 1899 - 1908 RAIL 491/1010 Saltley and Birmingham 1876 - 1908 RAIL 491/1011 Sheffield 1876 - 1908 RAIL 491/1012 Skipton, Keighley, Shipley and Hellifield 1876 - 1908 RAIL 491/1013 Toton 1876 - 1908 RAIL 491/1014 Trent, Lincoln, Mansfield and Westhouses 1876 - 1908 RAIL 491/1015 New appointments 1871 - 1877 RAIL 491/1016 New appointments 1877 - 1882 RAIL 491/1017 New appointments 1882 - 1890 RAIL 491/1018 New appointments 1890 - 1897 RAIL 491/1019 New appointments 1897 - 1900 RAIL 491/1020 New appointments Derby district 1902 - 1913 RAIL 491/1021 Additional appointments 1906 - 1930 RAIL 491/1022 Goods guards 1880 - 1898 RAIL 491/1023 Goods guards 1898 - 1908 RAIL 491/1024 Coaching department 1871 - 1879 RAIL 491/1025 Coaching department 1881 - 1898 RAIL 491/1026 Coaching department 1899 - 1908 RAIL 491/1027 Coaching department 1899 - 1908 RAIL 491/1028 Marshalling staff 1902 - 1908 RAIL 491/1029 Mineral office 1860 - 1875 RAIL 491/1030 Mineral office 1875 - 1895 RAIL 491/1031 Mineral office 1895 - 1921 RAIL 491/1032 Staff register 1868 - 1873 RAIL 491/1033 Staff register 1899 - 1902 RAIL 491/1034 Joint staff lists - includes dates of opening of joint lines and stations 1870 - 1876 RAIL 491/1035 Joint staff lists - includes dates of opening of joint lines and stations 1876 - 1892 RAIL 491/1036 Joint staff lists - includes dates of opening of joint lines and stations 1893 - 1906 RAIL 491/1037 Joint staff lists 1906 - 1920 RAIL 491/1038 Burton & Ashby Light Rly. 1906 - 1920 RAIL 491/1039 Staff list 1859 - 1866 RAIL 491/1040 Pedigree list RAIL 491/1041 Pedigree list I hope this is useful to other listers as well. Regards Ian Cuming Bristol
23--[DBY] Grave Classification. Hi All, A Lister (I think it was June Spooner?) recently asked a question regarding 'Unpurchased Grave Plots'. I was at Nottingham Road Cemetery today and asked the Staff. A Purchased grave plot is one that you would buy during your lifetime ready for the final day. The advantage being that you could choose where in the Cemetery you wish the plot to be. Once purchased the plot is yours for one hundred years and cannot be used again, except by family members, during this time. Once the hundred years is over the plot becomes the property of the authorities and can be reused. If you die and have expressed a wish to be buried, but have not bought your plot, you would be placed in an Unpurchased grave and your estate would presumably pay the cost. This type of grave is similar to a Paupers Grave, but in that instance, as neither your relatives or your estate had sufficient funds to pay for the funeral the authorities would pay for a very basic internment. Both Unpurchased and Paupers graves can be used again after 14 years. (Yes, 14, I did double check). However, I was told that this would be unlikely as the cemetery is so large that a much longer period is allowed before re-use. Also, if relative erected a headstone on a Unpurchased plot it is unlikely that the grave would be re-used unless really necessary. Additionally, within the Cemetery, there are different classes of grave plots. The 1st Class graves are nearest the Chapel, the 2nd Class a little further away and so on. As most of the 1st Class graves seemed to be of local dignitaries and have really ornate stone work I presumed that a plot in that area would cost considerably more than others. What the significance of being near to the Chapel is I don't know. Perhaps a Lister with more religious knowledge could enlighten us? Regards Paul Slater Derby UK
24--[DBY] National Burials Index project Amanda in OZ writes: << Hi i'm new and haven't heard of this project could someone please enlighten me ie what years will it cover etc. >> Here's a brief summary; I understand that a more complete article about the project will be appearing in a forthcoming issue of Family Tree Magazine... The IGI, produced by the LDS, is a great source for baptismal and marriage information, but information about deaths and burials are thin on the ground. To help fill this important genealogical void, the FFHS (Federation of Family History Societies) has initiated the NBI, a massive undertaking whose aim is to transcribe eventually all known deaths/burials in the UK, plus Ireland and the Channel Islands, and make the data available in a searchable database. Some 2 years ago, volunteers from around the world began the task of transcribing deaths or burials shown on microfiche copies of various parish registers, and then entering the data into a computer program(me) aptly named SHROUD. As various parishes have been completed for diverse time spans, the local FHS involved has made the data available, either on locally-produced organised microfiche or computer diskettes. Sheffield & District FHS, for example, has released well over a dozen sets of parish transcriptions to date. Some of these cover rather short time spans, such as 1813-1855, while other parishes are included with much longer coverage, beginning often with 1813 and running up well into the 1900s. Information as to which parishes have been completed, and for which time spans, can be obtained by enquiring of the FHS covering your area(s) of interest. The intent is to issue the entire UK-wide updated database on CD, perhaps every 2 years or so, and it's the delayed first release of the CD which I addressed in my earlier message. Just prior to the initial cutoff date for incorporating the collected data, 31 August, the national coordinator of the project received an additional 1,000,000 entries from the various FHSs! There are a couple of things about the NBI which we should keep in mind. First, the word *index* is a bit of a misnomer, since the transcriptions are more than just an index. Each transcribed entry contains nearly all of the information shown in the parish register - Name, date of burial, age, address, and relationship to others are all shown, IF the information is in the PR. Occasionally an entry on the PR has additional information, such as "died in Cornwall" for a person buried in Sheffield, and the NBI will tell you that such additional information exists, but won't tell you what it is, due to lack of space. Second, while a great deal of thought and effort has gone into ensuring that the transcriptions are accurately reflective of the information in the PR, these are still transcriptions, ie secondary sources, and should be verified against the original films or fiche of the PR, just like the IGI is a secondary source. No matter how much care goes into the transcription process, with redundant built-in checking procedures, misteaks can and will happen. Moreover, parish clarkes and vicars weren't always careful or consistent when they wrote down what they heard, or what they think they heard, from the informants. Street names are often spelt in diverse ways, for instance, and if a well-known street in Sheffield can show up with 3 different spellings by 3 different writers over the span of 5 pages of entries, as I encountered, you can imagine what may have been done to names... However, even with that caveat, I am personally awaiting the release with a great deal of anticipation. A learned genealogist friend of mine once remarked "Whenever I'm asked to look over someone's family tree, the first thing I insist on is that at least one of the parents is alive at the time the purported ancestor is born!" The NBI should help us construct better family trees. Dave in northern Illinois
25--[DBY] Certificates Jayne has asked me to post details of my certificate service to the list in view of teh fact that several of the list members have contacted her saying it was commercial. Many of you will know that I work for a Bank and until Dec 1 have the concession to pay cheques in currencies other than pounds ithout any form of commission. I have used this conecession to obtain certificates from local Registers of B D & Ms, for people on the list. Most of the local offices do not take credit card facilities and seek payment solely in pounds and also want a SAE. The cost of obtaining cheques in pounds for overseas folk is probably something which makes this avenue not cost effective, despite the fact that onthe whole most of them are far more helpful and genealogy friendly than the folks who should do it, ( I mean the ONS) Should your cert not be available then the local offices levy no fee, whereas the ONS charge £4.50. I do this at a cost of £7.70 which equates to the cost of the cert, postage in the UK and airmail back to US. There is also a cost of a nomianl 5 pence to cover three envelopes and paper as my employer has long since told me that one or two are OK, but the numbers I use are not acceptable. >From Dec 1st, a centralisation in the Bank's proceedures means that commissions which were previously a matter for my branch manager, ( and thus waived) will be levied centrally at a cost of £5. This is per submission so that if I am able to put 5 cheques in US$ together, then the cost works out at £1. Generally I do about 20 per week so there arelikely to be 7 or so of US $ C$ and A$ and the the commission will be about 75 pence. I have tried to negate this aspect by opening an account at paypal where credit card payments can be made to people who are too small become VISA/Mastercard Merchants although they levy a fee of 25c plus 2.5% on funds returned to the UK. It is also a bit cumbersome in that both parties must register to the use the service. Although it is free to register. I must stress that this is not a profit service. I have maintained a seperate account for this service throught it's existance and there is currently a balance of some £14 in it. This has been made due to exchange rate fluctuations and no doubt when the pound begins to rise against the US$ again, that gain will soon be wiped out. My signature line quite clearly states that this is not for profit. Most people who have used my service have been happy with it and have recommended others. Why do I do it. ? Because working in a quiet country branch of the Bank, I usually have a spare hour or so each day totype up three or four requests. That's all it takes. I hope I have put your minds at rest, butif not have a look at my web page, where not only will you will more details, but the 1871 census for Hurst, where I live, and several other snippets of information relating to my area. Kind regards Antony B D & M Certificates: Pay by credit card or with a Non Sterling cheque and get them direct from the local office of the Superintendent Registrar. See my low tech web page for details. www.certificates.fsnet.co.uk/certific.htm or email me at antonylambert@certificates.fsnet.co.uk . A not for profit service.
26--[DBY] Out of Wedlock I have a booklet acquired from the Derbyshire Family History Society called "Illegitimacy" by Eve McLaughlin and it is most helpful on the subject of children born out of wedlock. The following passages might be of help. Among ordinary labourers, the illegitimacy rate was inevitably higher, since even a couple who wished to marry there and then might not be able to. The relationship remained, and they mostly married later, before the second, or maybe the third, child was due. A young male labourer often lived in at the farmhouse, and neither there mor in the over-crowded family cottage was there room for a wife and child. It was simple common sense for a local girl to stay unmarried, rather than wed an incomer with no settlement in the village and risk being thrown out with him and the baby, if he lost his job or health. ......But no one expected a local girl to wed some roving Welsh or Irish labourer just to "give the baby a name", when it would have her perfectly good local name. .....The clergy had a professional duty to reprimand "incontinency" among their flock, but most of them were close enough in background to the farming community they served to accept what was natural, and they reserved their criticism for the prostitute, or for rape and incest. Strictly, a couple who produced a bastard child had to do penance in a white sheet in the church porch (in extreme cases in the market place) .......Each parish had to care for its own poor, which normally included the unmarried mother and her child, so it required to know all about the case, with details of the father's name and origins, with the intention of claiming back some of the expendityure from him. ....A common way of showing paternity is to give the male child his father's full name and the girl his surname. The idea is that if the couple marry later, the mother's surname can be dropped.e.g. John Smith son of Mary Brown is legally known as John Smith Brown until the wedding, and mabe after, if it is much delayed. As well, if the couple did marry later, the child was deemed to be legitimized. In my own family a gr. grandfather was born out of wedlock and was baptised with his mother's maiden name. His parents were married a year later and he assumed his father's surname, keeping the mother's maiden name as a second name, which was carried on through the male line as a second name. I suspect there was some reason, either monetary or perhaps political why they didn't marry before the child was born. Could have been family dissent to the marriage. In the Highlands of Scotland a child born out of wedlock was called "natural" and given the father's name at baptism, if known. As well, the father was expected to pay for the care of the child, if the parents didn't subsequently marry. Hope this helps and proves of interest to others. Anne Newmarket, Ont. Canada.
27--[DBY] English Origins Launch Although the following facility deals mostly with London entries, there would appear to be at least one national database (for apprentices), possibly more. Vic Assist. L.O. Derbysgen ================================== London, England ­ Press release 18 January 2001 Origins.net, in collaboration with the Society of Genealogists, announces the launch of English Origins. This will operate on a similar ‘pay per view’ basis to the company's existing Scots Origins service. The Society has agreed with Origins to allow important parts of its unique collection of British Isles material to be made available over the Internet, no longer restricting access to those able to visit the Society’s Library in London. The initial datasets are all of English records and will appear on the new English Origins site. Others may appear on different parts of the Origins site in due course. The English Origins database currently includes over one million names, covering the period 1568 to 1850, and including the indexes listed below. These indexes provide rich genealogical and biographical details and also allow you to locate otherwise inaccessible source documents. · Vicar-General Marriage Licence Allegations Index, 1694-1850 · Faculty Office Marriage Licence Allegations Index, 1701-1850 · Bank of England Will Extracts Index, 1717-1845 · London City Apprenticeship Abstracts, 1568-1850 · London Consistory Court Depositions Index, 1703-13 · Archdeaconry Court of London Wills Index, 1700-1807 Other records, which will be added to the collection over the course of 2001, include: · Boyd’s Marriage Index, over 6 million records · Apprentices of Great Britain,1710-74; over 600,000 records · Boyd's Inhabitants of London,14th-19th centuries; 60,000 families · Boyd's London Burials; 50,000 names · Prerogative Court of Canterbury Wills, 1750-1800; 333,000 records Access to the English Origins database is by credit or debit card, via a secure payment system. The charges are: £6 (about $9) for 48 hours continuous access to the database, with hard copies of original documents (which can be ordered online) costing £10 (about $14.50). A free surname search facility is available to determine whether there are any potentially interesting records for a given surname. Members of the Society of Genealogists are allowed one free 48 hour access each calendar quarter. This will allow members to view a maximum of 150 of the Society's online records during each of these accesses. Additionally, members will be given a 20% discount on orders made via English Origins for hard copies provided by the Society, i.e. £8 instead of £10. About the Society of Genealogists The Society of Genealogists offers a unique combination of research material, guidance and support for those interested in family history. It is a charity whose objects are to promote, encourage and foster the study, science and knowledge of genealogy. Their library is the foremost in the British Isles with a large collection of family histories, civil registration and census material, and the widest collection of Parish Register copies in the country (over 9,000). Robert Gordon, Director of the Society of Genealogists said "As an educational charity, the Society is eager to make its unique collection available to family historians world-wide ­ not just to those who find it convenient to come to our Library in London when we are open." About Origins.net Origins.net was founded in 1997 to work with the custodians of valuable genealogical information to assist them in using the Internet to provide broader access to family history researchers. Since this time it has been home to Scots Origins, providing exclusive on line access to the General Register Office for Scotland’s birth, marriage and death records, covering the period 1553 to 1925 Origins.net is quoted in The Good Web Guide as: "an absolutely central resource for all genealogists..." Scots Origins has been praised by The Herald as: "a model consumer website with clear instructions and an excellent demo." Ian Galbraith, CEO and founder of the company, stated: "Origins.net and the Internet allows millions of family historians worldwide to access an extraordinary amount of genealogical material, allowing for more productive research. Using the Internet for family history research eliminates distance barriers, and creates strong ‘virtual communities’, linked together by family, heritage and history. We are delighted to work with the Society of Genealogists to allow Web access to their rich holdings." Contacts Jane Hewitt Robert Gordon Origins.net Director Charter House Society of Genealogists 2 Farringdon Road 14 Charterhouse Buildings London EC1M 3HP London EC1M 7BA T: 020-7251 6117 T: 020-7251 8799 F: 020-8868 1160 F: 020-72550 1800 E: pr@origins.net E: director@sog.org.uk =========== The 48 hour period starts when you register for access and runs out after two days. You may come and go during that period using your registered user-name. I would strongly advise users to explore the site, read about the databases, try the free search and understand the site before registering. Plan your searches in advance. Geoffrey T. Stone, SoG Mailing List Administrator. lists@sog.org.uk
28--[DBY] How do I? (Wills) Hello listers I've been using wills recently and had quite a lot of success. I do know of two indexes - first, the National Probate Index (wills after 1858) lists them all alphabetically within a year (by date of probate, not date of death so if probate was delayed the record may be found in the following year's volume). The index gives place of death, last known address (if different), date of death and names of executors so you can usually tell if it's the right person. Some local records offices have the index either in book or fiche form, or you can try the Probate Office in the town where you live. If you live abroad I don't know how to access it - do the LDS have it filmed? A copy of a will costs £5 - sometimes this is excellent value as you get a lot of information - other times it may not give you much more than you already know. Any Probate Office can order a copy of a will for you - if it's a local person they get it while you wait, otherwise it takes a couple of days by post. I think there is also an address in York that you can send off to. The other wills index I know of is for the Perogative Court of Canterbury - can't remember what years this covers but I think it goes up to about 1800. I've seen it in book form in libraries. PCC wills can be obtained from London, or via companies that obtain BMD certificates for you. The PCC covered the southern half of England so you won't find many Derbyshire wills in there. Other than that, each county records office is likely to carry a collection of wills, but I don't know of any national index other than the two I've mentioned. Hope this helps Alan
29--[OEL] The Yeoman's House - Part VIII. Value (continued) + Calendar Many yeoman wills mention servants. Great care must be used in interpreting these as an indicator of wealth, for they were generally employed, both male and female, to do the work of the farm rather than wait on the yeoman and his family. Their numbers therefore reflect the specific needs of the farm rather than wealth. One of these needs was, obviously, the amount of work to be done, which depended on the type of farm and how labor-intensive were its particular activities. The size and nature of the household also determined need -- a small farmer with several sons and one or two daughters to help with housework, dairying, brewing, etc. might not require any outside help except at harvest and other busy times. Another consideration is the time period, for the practice of hiring by the year was giving way to the hiring of day laborers. In earlier times, feeding a few more meant nothing because there was no market for the surplus, but expanding markets and rising prices meant the more available to market, the better. Well-to-do yeomen had several servants and could also hire by the day (or hour or piece) as needed. Yeoman wills and other documents citing three, four or five manservants are not unusual. One yeoman of Gloucestershire had eight manservants in 1608; muster rolls, however, suggest that the average for yeomen in the county at that time was 1.1. Living in the household might be one or more apprentices in husbandry, by choice or perhaps as fulfillment of a parish obligation to care for the orphaned or needy. Such apprentices would receive no wages -- just their board and a suit of clothes at the end of the apprenticeship. It should be remembered that ordinarily the yeoman's wife did as much work as anyone; if a servant was hired it was not to relieve her but to do the work which was beyond her capacity. Consistent with what has been said earlier, a gentleman's daughter married off to a wealthy yeoman might well have an easier life -- and a personal maid as well. But no matter how hard the yeoman's wife or daughter might work, certain tasks were considered inappropriate for their station. This included working in the fields or caring for livestock, properly the work of laborers' wives and daughters. Campbell cites a Star Chamber case in which a Berkshire yeoman's daughter complained that her stepfather gave her 'very base service to do about the husbandly and household affairs in keeping cattle, swyne and sheep' such as were 'uncomely offices' for a young girl of her degree. And while work of the yeoman's wife and daughters was normally limited to their own households, it should be noted that this might involve helping with secondary activities that yeomen sometimes engaged in -- running an inn or tavern that was also the family home, tending a shop set up in or near the home or, in textile areas, weaving for the local market. Another thing to have in mind when analyzing yeomen's wills and inventories is the time of year -- barns were at their fullest just after harvest. Some crops might be held back intentionally for late winter and early spring when prices were highest, a time when old stocks were becoming exhausted but no new crop was in. The following calendar showing the yearly round of activities was compiled by Campbell from surviving farm calendars, almanacs, diaries, etc. These of course varied from farm to farm and place to place with many such as sowing occurring much later in northern counties. January-February. Plow lands, harrow, and spread with manure. Set trees and hedges. Prune fruit trees. Lop timber. March-April. "Stir" land for wheat and rye again and sow. Sow vetches, oats and barley. Now through early May, plant gardens; trail vines to poles in hops districts; scour ditches, clean coppices. May As above, but also time for weaning sheep, and a month to watch sheep closely for 'the rot' June Wash and shear sheep. Lime, marl and manure fields for summer plowing. July Make hay; if time before the grain harvest, get in supply of wood, turf or coal for winter. August Harvest, continuing into September. Hire extra help. September-October Sow rye and, a little later, wheat. Make cider and perry (apple and pear regions). Prune trees and hedges. Plant rosebushes and bulbous roots. Attend fairs throughout the fall, buying, selling and bartering stock and produce. November until winter sets in Slaughter animals for winter's meat. Put out straw to rot for enriching next year's fields. Bring in stock that will not winter outdoors. Cover asparagus and strawberry beds. December Plow land for beans. Finish any chores for wintering over -- gathering fuel, etc. A few days at Christmas for feasting and making merry, doing only the necessary chores and caring for the farm animals. Almost immediately the cycle begins again. >From Mildred Campbell, The English Yeoman Under Elizabeth and the Early Stuarts. This concludes the series on 'The Yeoman's House.' Judith Werner Administrator, OLD-ENGLISH-L Hayward, California, USA
30--[DBY] Doing Genealogy as a job? On Wed, 7 Mar 2001 16:29:36 -0000, Janet Ford wrote: >Does anyone know how to become a professional >Genealogist? Do those of you who do this for a >living find that it produces a sufficient income to support >a family? Where do you get referrals from? Any other >information you can give me to help me decide whether or not >to go for it would be very gratefully received. For Janet, and to open the debate for the Mailing List:- In UK there are several professional qualifications for which one can study, and particularly one needs to be accepted by a professional society (showing examples of your work), so as to use those initials after your name, if you are to be respected. I considered the possibility of doing Genealogy professionally, but in the end decided against it. I don't wish to influence Janet (or anyone else), but I thought it might be useful to state the considerations I gave to this subject and the reasons for my deciding against it. 1. VARIABLE RESEARCH TIME With genealogy, it is extremely variable as to how much information one can find within a certain time. I know from my own families:- - In some cases they were tenant farmers who remained in one village for about three centuries, so that I found a whole pedigree in just a few visits to the relevant County Record Office. - In another case, I hit the proverbial brick wall at about 1820, and did not find where they came from for a further four years. - Then there was the landed family, who not only appeared in numerous published sources, but also left hundreds of deeds and wills over the centuries, which made it possible to check and verify the printed sources, taking that family back with certainty to 1539, and with possibilities reaching back to the 1100s. - Then there are the travelling chimney sweeps, who moved about all over the place and whose origins came to a dead stop in 1726. 2. FEES AND METHODS How do you set the level of fees, so as to be able to satisfy the client, while also making enough to be a viable income for yourself? The components need to include:- - Research time - Travelling expenses - Copying expenses The necessary steps:- - You have to first get a statement from the client of all they currently know; possibly using a standard assessment-form you have devised. - You then make an initial assessment on that; possibly using a standard assessment-fee, you have set. - Then make step-by-step reports, stating your progress and the likelihood of being able to get results within particular time-limits, suggesting how much it is going to cost in research time, so that you enable the client to make the decisions appropriate to their own financial circumstances. 3. TIME/COSTS ORGANISATION You would have to organise your time so that you visit certain major central record repositories with a whole list of questions to be answered from different clients, so as to make the travelling costs to that place a viable proposition. Travelling costs would have to be part of the formula of charges. It requires one to be extremely well organised, and it all seemed rather too fraught for my liking, so that what I now do as an enjoyable hobby would become too much a stressful chore. Best wishes with your own decision Sonia Addis-Smith Thurleigh, Bedfordshire, England

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